New: Knock-outs

[NadelinaIG]

Hi @tomjer, unfortunately the new ESMA regulations means that we are unable to offer margin offsets. Unfortunately this includes options strategies. In regards to new products, we are continuing to review our offering post-ESMA and if there are ever any new products released we'll make sure to update our client base. 

[NadelinaIG]

Hi @cate, there are no current plans to add KO to CFD accounts. Should that change in future, we will aim to notify all CFD account holders via the regular marketing emails. Please make sure you have the appropriate settings and marketing preferences in your notification sections of MyIG (https://www.ig.com/uk/myig/settings/notifications), or make sure you keep an eye out on Community. 

 

[Bunton]

Offers wide swing trade style stop losses without the ability to move a stop to entry, a fundamental for me on swing trades. It'll be of benefit for traders who continuously move stop losses, hoping a dodgy trade will come back into profit - KOs will enforce that discipline. OK for scalpers who grab a few points here and there & can pull the ripcord manually when it doesn't feel right.

It'll have its uses, a decent addition to IGs markets :-)

 

[Caseynotes]

Hi @Bunton,  There has been talk from IG that an additional 'inner stop' for the KOs is in development which will add to it's appeal for those not able to monitor as closely as a scalper.

[Ozee]

The KO's are unsuitable for me as I prefer to put in an order, stop loss and limit and not have to closely monitor the market and wait for price and technicals to confirm entry - as is the case with KOs. I just do not have the time to sit by the screen and observe what price is doing every minute of the day...it does my head in!

Seems like eventually I'll no have choice but to deposit much more money to cover the margin requirements to spread bet as near normal to what I did before these ESMA regulations from the EU...(roll on Brexit!)

[Kodiak]

2 hours ago, Ozee said:

The KO's are unsuitable for me as I prefer to put in an order, stop loss and limit and not have to closely monitor the market and wait for price and technicals to confirm entry - as is the case with KOs. I just do not have the time to sit by the screen and observe what price is doing every minute of the day...it does my head in!

Seems like eventually I'll no have choice but to deposit much more money to cover the margin requirements to spread bet as near normal to what I did before these ESMA regulations from the EU...(roll on Brexit!)

I suppose it has something to do with ESMA and that the KO is some kind of option and that makes things more complicated?

But as i said before if we could trade KO using prorealtime/proorder and maybe metatrader then we could use the program to open and close the trade if certain condition is met

i dont see why ESMA would have any problem with that?

so lets wait and see whats happens 

[xnox]

Need pending order to open, for entry - not just level, but min/max premium specified as well.

Need the ability to trade against underlying index future, rather than cash index, ie. against ftse 100 September futures no the ftse 100 cash.

[PandaFace]

3 minutes ago, xnox said:

Need pending order to open, for entry - not just level, but min/max premium specified as well.

Need the ability to trade against underlying index future, rather than cash index, ie. against ftse 100 September futures no the ftse 100 cash.

But then you’re gonna be forced out of the trade and can’t keep it going? 

Ideally they set up both. DFB and future settlement. 

[InconnectTrading]

Hi All, great to see this new Knockout instrument, will support be added to the IG API? If it doesn't already exist when will it be coming?

[NadelinaIG]

Hi @InconnectTrading, this has not been introduced yet, unfortunately, but I have forwarded your request to the relevant team.

[InconnectTrading]

@NadelinaIG Excellent thanks for your response, hopefully API support will be introduced ? 

[Ozee]

Hi - any reason as to why KO's are limited to certain currency pairs only? I have tried to use KO's today to trade GBP/AUD it does not exist in the KO listing?

[Caseynotes]

Hi @Ozee, it's a new product still in development with IG implementing a staged rollout and seeking client input such as yours. Hopefully more pairs and other asset classes will be added before too long.

[Ozee]

@CaseynotesThank you for your response...

[Guest Turnip]

On 8/26/2018 at 11:10 PM, Kodiak said:

I suppose it has something to do with ESMA and that the KO is some kind of option and that makes things more complicated?

But as i said before if we could trade KO using prorealtime/proorder and maybe metatrader then we could use the program to open and close the trade if certain condition is met

i dont see why ESMA would have any problem with that?

so lets wait and see whats happens 

So I cannot use MT4 to trade the new KO's ?

[Caseynotes]

Hi  Guest Turnip, no there is no options type trading on mt4, the KOs are only available on the new web based platform.

[Tancredi]

I tried a Wall Street Bull KO for the first time today.  It's only when you try to follow the profit/loss alongside the chart that you realise how difficult it is to get a feel for where the KO is actually trading, and therefore where to set a mental stop so that the KO actually mirrors the standard Wall Street spreadbet trade.  Also it is not at all obvious where one's entry level actually is in relation to the index.

With that in mind. I'd like to propose this: a combined tear-off ticket which shows both the standard spreadbet Buy and Sell and the KO running position.  Depending on whether the position was entered via the standard ticket or the KO ticket, the method not used to enter could be there for information only.  This would avoid confusion when using the ticket alongside the chart (to exit) and it would make it very obvious when one's mental stop level is reached.

[Caseynotes]

Hi @Tancredi, trading 'options' style takes a bit of getting use to at first but IG have made the KOs relatively accessible to spread betters giving set entry value options and hopefully soon an inner adjustable stop loss.

To get use to the different format you might try running the KO and the spread bet chart side by side while you practice and get more familiar with the KOs.

[Tancredi]

Yes, Caseynotes, I see what you mean.  Practice makes perfect.  ?

[PandaFace]

It’s certainly a bit of getting used to on these knock outs! It’s a new product and altho I know and can get my head around regular options this new knock out does take a little getting used to!! Keep at it @Tancredi and yeh - practice makes perfect. 

I don’t know about anyone else but I think I’d be keen on some knock out videos and strategy? I know for those who trade it may be easy but I think others (and me  ) would find it useful ??

[JamesIG]

9 hours ago, PandaFace said:

It’s certainly a bit of getting used to on these knock outs! It’s a new product and altho I know and can get my head around regular options this new knock out does take a little getting used to!! Keep at it @Tancredi and yeh - practice makes perfect. 

I don’t know about anyone else but I think I’d be keen on some knock out videos and strategy? I know for those who trade it may be easy but I think others (and me  ) would find it useful ??

Thanks for the suggestion @PandaFace - I'll make sure to put it to our IGTV team and analysts. 

[trade247]

9 hours ago, PandaFace said:

It’s certainly a bit of getting used to on these knock outs! It’s a new product and altho I know and can get my head around regular options this new knock out does take a little getting used to!! Keep at it @Tancredi and yeh - practice makes perfect. 

I don’t know about anyone else but I think I’d be keen on some knock out videos and strategy? I know for those who trade it may be easy but I think others (and me  ) would find it useful ??

Seconded! Like those index and gold strategies they tweet out in the mid morning. That would be insightful.

[Tancredi]

Not long after I posted yesterday I discovered that there is a tear-off option for the KO ticket.  It's accessed by right-clicking on the security and choosing "Open ticket in new window" from the drop-down menu.  Previously this was the "Tear-off Ticket" option.  

I should have said that I prefer the old platform to the new one and so, apart from yesterday being my first KO trade, it was also a foray into unfamiliar platform territory. 

[Eclipse]

Just a thought. (I haven't played with the KO's - like many I'd want a closer stop).

Suppose the market is EURUSD.
You want to go KO long from 11700 and the KO-stop will default to about 11580 (120 points) - but you'd really like a stop of 20 points.

Can you also have a KO-short keyed in to open at 11680?

If the price moves against you, the short opens and you're position is hedged at -20 points.
You can then close both positions manually at the same time and keep the circa 20 point stop - if you're quick enough.

Or would the positions nett each other off to zero??

[Tancredi]

That's really interesing,Eclipse.  I don't see why it wouldn't work if you could use the "force open" option on the stop order to enter the short.  I think you'd end up with approximately double the effective margin for what is, in effect, a much less risky trade (because you'd have the much closer stop).  What am I missing?

[Eclipse]

36 minutes ago, Tancredi said:

That's really interesing,Eclipse.  I don't see why it wouldn't work if you could use the "force open" option on the stop order to enter the short.  I think you'd end up with approximately double the effective margin for what is, in effect, a much less risky trade (because you'd have the much closer stop).  What am I missing?

Having just looked at a ticket, I don't think you can key in stop or limit orders.

Each order has to be entered 'live'(?).

In the example, you'd just be sitting there watching the price move in order to open a KO-short at 11680.
You might as well wait to manually close at 11680 for a 20 point loss.
I don't see an advantage, and as you say the margin requirement doubles.

[Tancredi]

Ah, that's what I was missing

Too bad.

[Tancredi]

Back to the subject of tear-off tickets for KOs:

Yes, there is a KO tear-off ticket but, as far as I can see, that is only to open a position.  In order to close a position you have to use the "Close" button in the "Positions" page.  What I'd like to see is the equivalent of the tear-out ticket for a spread bet so that this can be opened in a reduced window to accompany a Pro real Time chart.  (It's possible to reduce the entire "Positions" window but this also reduces any other tabs.  Or one can open a new window but this imposes unnecessary work on the user's CPU.)

I'd also like to see the KO ticket give a "synthetic" overview of the trade as though it were a simple spread bet.  This would remove the need to do an unnecessary amount of mental arithmetic in order to get to the actual opening level on the underlying.  I arrive at this because I don't trade on a chart of the risk premium (who does?) but rather on a chart of the underlying.  To relate risk premium to underlying is ok when it comes to designing the product but faithfully referring to the calculations involved in doing that need not be the main aim of the ticket.  It would be much simpler for the trader to see a price and a stop rather than a stop and a price.

[Tancredi]

As there's been no further activity on this thread since my post on 14/9, and as I've had time to think about the problem a bit more, I wonder if the lack of KO "tickets to close" might be to do with the difference in risk associated with a long trade wrt a short trade.  If that is the case, might it not be possible to engineer a ticket which has a graphic to show nett-off plus or minus?  Sometimes the close would be augmented and sometimes reduced, depending on which side of the market carried greater risk.  Or am I just missing the point again (as usual)? 

[Kodiak]

I dont use metatrader much but i think its possible to run a EA on FTSE dfb and place the trades on something else?

and if we could do that (run ea on ftse dfb) and place the trades on FTSE KO then it open up new ways to trade KO?